Understanding allometry

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Understanding allometry

From: Nick Holford Date: May 23, 2016 technical
Steve, Thanks for your comments and questions on theory based allometry. I have cross-posted it to nmusers because this topic has been of interest there over many years. I am aware that you wrote an editorial on this topic with Denis Fisher which you titled “Allometry, Shallometry!”. Having read your editorial and your comments I don’t think the implication that allometry is shallow is appropriate. On the contrary, I get the impression (see below) that you and Denis do not really understand the biological principles underlying allometry and seem to be unaware of the substantial literature supporting theory based allometry and its application in humans. Would your journal be willing to receive a rejoinder to your editorial with a deeper explanation of the science and the literature? Best wishes, Nick Nick Holford, MBChB, FRACP Professor of Clinical Pharmacology, University of Auckland Adjunct Professor of Bioengineering and Therapeutic Sciences, UCSF
Quoted reply history
On 21-May-16 00:42, Steven L Shafer <sshafer_at_stanford.edu> wrote: > Nick: > > You say below: > > "Theory based allometry predicts an exponent of 3/4 for many functional processes e.g. basal metabolism, cardiac output, lung volume flow (West et al 1997). It is not restricted to metabolism." > > The article you cite by West is an excellent treatise on the subject of scaling across species. There are numerous other papers that provide theoretical foundations for allometric scaling across species (e.g., Darveau, Nature, 2002; West, J Exp Biol. 2005). The allometric theory accounts for differences in rate-related functions across species that span many orders of magnitude in body mass. I am not aware of any theory that supports scaling by weight to the 3/4 power WITHIN A SPECIES. NH: Unfortunately, you repeat a common misunderstanding of allometric theory that it is somehow only applicable across species. Allometric theory as originally proposed by West is based only on body mass (West, Brown et al. 1997). Allometric theory does not require consideration of species or any other covariate. This is the first commandment of allometry (Holford 2008). If you read the work by West et al. you will find that there is nothing in the theory that prevents its use for within species scaling using mass. Therefore the theory of West supports the use of the 3/4 exponent within species. SS: > Similarly, I am unaware of unambiguous data strongly supporting allometric scaling across the typical range of human weights. NH: I recommend that you read the paper by McCune et al. that formally tests the allometric theory prediction of an exponent of 3/4 for clearance based on a large study of busulfan across the human size range (McCune, Bemer et al. 2014). The theory was tested explicitly and no evidence found to reject the value of 3/4. Work with a drug where your expertise is renowned ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gD7BZIl2uzc) has clearly demonstrated the benefit of allometric theory across humans from infants to adults. Eleveld showed the fit was improved using theory based allometric scaling (Eleveld, Proost et al. 2014)Schuttler also demonstrated an improved fit with an estimated exponent for clearance 0.75 which is consistent with the theoretical value of 3/4 (Schuttler and Ihmsen 2000). In the spirit of modern scientific philosophy are you aware of unambiguous data (and analysis) that falsifies the theory of allometry ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Popper)? SS: > > As applied to human pharmacokinetics, I do not believe any theory supports allometric scaling. NH: As noted above there is nothing in the theory of allometry proposed by West that would mean it is not applicable to humans. If you do not want to believe this theory then that is your personal choice, as it would be for any religious belief, and I will not attempt to change your religion. SS: > You can see this if you consider the ends of the spectrum. Small size is associated with children. They are not a separate species, but are humans undergoing metabolic maturation. NH: I have personally been a strong advocate on considering all humans, regardless of age, as being a single species and have sought integrated explanations of human clinical pharmacology. If you were aware of the paediatric pharmacokinetic literature then you would know of many publications supporting the use of a combination of theory based allometry for size plus empirical maturation models for age (see this review (Holford, Heo et al. 2013)). SS: > I am not aware of any allometric theory that accounts for metabolic maturation with age. NH: From the first commandment it necessarily follows that changes associated with age are not predictable from the allometric theory of West et al. There is no age related theory to predict quantitative changes. However, plausible biological understanding of maturation means that clearance will be zero (or at least very small) at conception and will approach a maximum when it will be indistinguishable from the mature adult value. So at least at the extremes there is a biological and quantitative prediction of maturation. Joining these extremes requires an empirical approach. A monotonic sigmoid emax function has been suggested (Tod, Jullien et al. 2008)and widely applied (Holford, Heo et al. 2013). A more complex function may be needed but this will need to be driven first by data not by theory. SS: > Similarly, very large size is associated with morbid obesity. I am not aware of any allometric theory that suggests that clearance in morbid obesity is best estimated using allometric principles. Between these extremes, scaling by weight is not very different than scaling by weight to the three quarters power. NH: Body composition contributes to body mass. Theory based allometry does not specify how differences in body composition affect allometric size. It is plausible however to propose that the size that is the driving force behind allometric theory may not be determined simply by total body weight. Application of theory based allometry in conjunction with fat free mass can be used to determine a normal fat mass (NFM) (Anderson and Holford 2009). The NFM concept has been used to account for body composition differences determining allometric size. NFM is not predicted from allometric theory but is a biologically plausible extension of the theory of allometric size based on mass. NFM has been used to show that total body mass rather than fat free mass provides a better description of propofol pharmacokinetics in the obese (Cortinez, Anderson et al. 2010). It has also be used to show that fat free mass is a better predictor of dexmedetomidine but obesity is associated with reduced clearance independently of allometric size based on fat free mass (Cortinez, Anderson et al. 2015). This demonstrates how the complexities of biology can be better understood based on a plausible theory of allometry. The theory may not be perfect but it is compatible with a very large number of observation studies in many domains. Investigation of other phenomena such as maturation and obesity is aided by building on allometric theory. SS: > > Of course, I will defer to data. Can you point me to human PK examples where allometric scaling of weight to the three quarters power reliably provides substantially better fits to the data than scaling by weight alone? NH: In addition to the large study of busulfan PK mentioned previously (McCune, Bemer et al. 2014)I suggest you look at the prediction of morphine clearance across the human size and age range using theory based allometry with maturation. Prediction of clearance in a large external data set was clearly better than other approaches including empirical allometry (Holford, Ma et al. 2012). Other published examples can be found in this review (Holford, Heo et al. 2013). SS: > I can point to many examples where it makes no difference. I can also point to many examples where investigators simply use allometric scaling without first seeing if allometric scaling was supported by the data. NH: This is often the case when sample sizes are small, weight distribution is narrow and power is small (Anderson and Holford 2008). A pragmatic approach given the challenges of falsifying allometric theory with small data sets is to assume it is useful. It is certainly better than using empirical allometry or ignoring size altogether. SS: > However, I know of only one or two examples where models were estimated with and without allometric scaling, and the allometric scaling worked better than the simpler non-scaled model. If allometric scaling for human pharmacokinetics was “true” on first principles, as your comments imply, then the literature should abound with unequivocal examples. NH: If you know of examples of suitably powered studies which can also show they have accounted for other mass correlated factors that would confound the estimation of a true allometric exponent then I would be glad to know the details. If you read the literature carefully and exclude those that are underpowered to truly detect the difference between an exponent of 3/4 and say an exponent of 1 or an exponent of 2/3 and have accounted for all other factors, such as maturation, that are necessarily correlated with mass then you will not find many examples. I am not aware of any that are inconsistent with allometric theory. SS: > > Thanks, > > Steve > -- > Steven L. Shafer, MD > Professor of Anesthesiology, Perioperative and Pain Medicine, Stanford University > Adjunct Associate Professor of Bioengineering and Therapeutic Sciences, UCSF > > ######################################################################## > > PharmPK Home Page https://www.pharmpk.com/ > Information about PK/PD Jobs can be found at https://www.pharmpk.com/pkjob.html > More information about my eBooks, including Basic Pharmacokinetics and Pharmacy Math, and now iOS and tvOS apps can be found at https://www.pharmpk.com/MyeBooks.html > Thank you, David Bourne, PharmPK Moderator > > To unsubscribe from the PHARMPK list, click the following link: > http://lists.ucdenver.edu/scripts/wa.exe?SUBED1=PHARMPK&A=1 Anderson, B. J. and N. H. Holford (2008). "Mechanism-based concepts of size and maturity in pharmacokinetics." _Annu Rev Pharmacol Toxicol_ *48*: 303-332. Anderson, B. J. and N. H. G. Holford (2009). "Mechanistic basis of using body size and maturation to predict clearance in humans." _Drug Metab Pharmacokinet_ *24*(1): 25-36. Cortinez, L. I., B. J. Anderson, N. H. Holford, V. Puga, N. de la Fuente, H. Auad, S. Solari, F. A. Allende and M. Ibacache (2015). "Dexmedetomidine pharmacokinetics in the obese." _Eur J Clin Pharmacol_ *doi:10.1007/s00228-015-1948-2*. Cortinez, L. I., B. J. Anderson, A. Penna, L. Olivares, H. R. Munoz, N. H. Holford, M. M. Struys and P. Sepulveda (2010). "Influence of obesity on propofol pharmacokinetics: derivation of a pharmacokinetic model." _Br J Anaesth_ *105*(4): 448-456. Eleveld, D. J., J. H. Proost, L. I. Cortinez, A. R. Absalom and M. M. Struys (2014). "A general purpose pharmacokinetic model for propofol." _Anesthesia and analgesia_ *118*(6): 1221-1237. Holford, N. (2008). "Re: [NMusers] Scaling for pediatric study planning." http://www.cognigencorp.com/nonmem/current/2008-September/0182.html. Holford, N., Y. A. Heo and B. Anderson (2013). "A pharmacokinetic standard for babies and adults." _J Pharm Sci_ *102*(9): 2941-2952. Holford, N. H., S. C. Ma and B. J. Anderson (2012). "Prediction of morphine dose in humans." _Paediatr Anaesth_ *22*(3): 209-222. McCune, J. S., M. J. Bemer, J. S. Barrett, K. Scott Baker, A. S. Gamis and N. H. G. Holford (2014). "Busulfan in Infant to Adult Hematopoietic Cell Transplant Recipients: A Population Pharmacokinetic Model for Initial and Bayesian Dose Personalization." _Clinical Cancer Research_ *20*(3): 754-763. Schuttler, J. and H. Ihmsen (2000). "Population pharmacokinetics of propofol: a multicenter study." _Anesthesiology_ *92*(3): 727-738. Tod, M., V. Jullien and G. Pons (2008). "Facilitation of drug evaluation in children by population methods and modelling." _Clin Pharmacokinet_ *47*(4): 231-243. West, G. B., J. H. Brown and B. J. Enquist (1997). "A general model for the origin of allometric scaling laws in biology." _Science_ *276*: 122-126. -- Nick Holford, Professor Clinical Pharmacology Dept Pharmacology & Clinical Pharmacology, Bldg 503 Room 302A University of Auckland,85 Park Rd,Private Bag 92019,Auckland,New Zealand office:+64(9)923-6730 mobile:NZ+64(21)46 23 53 FR+33(6)62 32 46 72 email:n.holford_at_auckland.ac.nz http://holford.fmhs.auckland.ac.nz/ "Declarative languages are a form of dementia -- they have no memory of events" Holford SD, Allegaert K, Anderson BJ, Kukanich B, Sousa AB, Steinman A, Pypendop, B., Mehvar, R., Giorgi, M., Holford,N.H.G. Parent-metabolite pharmacokinetic models - tests of assumptions and predictions. Journal of Pharmacology & Clinical Toxicology. 2014;2(2):1023-34. Holford N. Clinical pharmacology = disease progression + drug action. Br J Clin Pharmacol. 2015;79(1):18-27.

Re: Understanding allometry

From: Dennis Fisher Date: May 23, 2016 technical
Nick Your condescending tone is not appropriate — Steve did not insult you nor should you insult him. An apology is due. You, Steve, and I had the same mentor — Lewis Sheiner. His most important teaching was LET THE DATA SPEAK. When theory and evidence clash, Lewis would not blindly stick to theory. In this instance, Steve asked you to provide EVIDENCE to support your claim that allometric scaling would yield markedly better fits than weight-normalization. You offered the McCune article to support your argument (without mentioning your vested interest as an author). In that article, you wrote: all clearance (CL,Q) and volume (V1,V2) parameters were scaled for body size and composition using allometric theory and predicted fat free mass (FFM).(19–21) It does not appear that you evaluated a weight-normalized model. If you don’t look, you never see! I also note that the table reports the following: CL Clearance L/h/62kg NFM CL 11.4 (1.1) This brings up the issue of SAFETY. I was a clinician for several decades and Steve continues to be an active clinician. I don’t know if you see patients. However, many participants in this mailing list have never selected a dose of a drug, then administered it to a patient. I venture to say that most clinicians when faced with a dosing regimen that requires raising weight to the 3/4 power would run in the opposite direction (or, make a dosing error). The entry in the table is even more problematic. A clinician first needs to calculate NFM, then they need to realize that the dose is not proportional to 11.4 by a factor of weight/62. If the goal of PK is publishing journal articles about pure science, your approach might be OK. But, as far as I know, the goal is to improve patient safety. If there were a strong (or even moderate) preference for allometrically-scaled models, I would support their use. But, Steve asked you to provide EVIDENCE for this and you failed to do you. You also cited Eleveld’s article. Although his manuscript did include one weight-normalized model, the allometric model required multiple additional terms to fit the data. In particular, that article (as yours) required a “maturation” term to describe younger patients. In other words, neither of these articles demonstrates that allometric models are sufficient to describe the range of sizes in humans. Had Eleveld added those extra terms to the weight-normalized model, it might have performed as well as the model he published. Over the past two decades, I have analyzed data from > 200 studies including many in infants and children. In many of these, I have compared weight-normalized and allometric (and, in adults, unscaled) approaches. In virtually all cases, the difference in fit between the weight-normalized and allometric approaches was trivial and often favored the weight-normalized approach. Can you cite cases in which the allometric approach fares much better? I also have had the opportunity to be an editor for a journal and to review articles for many journals (and I have reviewed submissions by many people who participate in this mailing list). In many instances, authors refuse to evaluate a weight-normalized model, citing you. In many of these instances, I have insisted that the authors conduct that analysis and (as far as I can recall) there has never been strong evidence to support the allometric model. I repeat — if you don’t look, you don’t see. I suspect that Steve will have more to add. Dennis Dennis Fisher MD P < (The "P Less Than" Company) Phone / Fax: 1-866-PLessThan (1-866-753-7784) www.PLessThan.com
Quoted reply history
> On May 23, 2016, at 12:17 AM, Nick Holford <n.holford_at_auckland.ac.nz> wrote: > > Steve, > > Thanks for your comments and questions on theory based allometry. I have cross-posted it to nmusers because this topic has been of interest there over many years. > > > I am aware that you wrote an editorial on this topic with Denis Fisher which you titled “Allometry, Shallometry!”. Having read your editorial and your comments I don’t think the implication that allometry is shallow is appropriate. On the contrary, I get the impression (see below) that you and Denis do not really understand the biological principles underlying allometry and seem to be unaware of the substantial literature supporting theory based allometry and its application in humans. > > > Would your journal be willing to receive a rejoinder to your editorial with a deeper explanation of the science and the literature? > > Best wishes, > > > Nick > > Nick Holford, MBChB, FRACP > > Professor of Clinical Pharmacology, University of Auckland > > Adjunct Professor of Bioengineering and Therapeutic Sciences, UCSF > > > On 21-May-16 00:42, Steven L Shafer <sshafer_at_stanford.edu> wrote: >> Nick: >> You say below: >> "Theory based allometry predicts an exponent of 3/4 for many functional processes e.g. basal metabolism, cardiac output, lung volume flow (West et al 1997). It is not restricted to metabolism." >> The article you cite by West is an excellent treatise on the subject of scaling across species. There are numerous other papers that provide theoretical foundations for allometric scaling across species (e.g., Darveau, Nature, 2002; West, J Exp Biol. 2005). The allometric theory accounts for differences in rate-related functions across species that span many orders of magnitude in body mass. I am not aware of any theory that supports scaling by weight to the 3/4 power WITHIN A SPECIES. > > NH: Unfortunately, you repeat a common misunderstanding of allometric theory that it is somehow only applicable across species. Allometric theory as originally proposed by West is based only on body mass (West, Brown et al. 1997). Allometric theory does not require consideration of species or any other covariate. This is the first commandment of allometry (Holford 2008). If you read the work by West et al. you will find that there is nothing in the theory that prevents its use for within species scaling using mass. Therefore the theory of West supports the use of the 3/4 exponent within species. > > > SS: >> Similarly, I am unaware of unambiguous data strongly supporting allometric scaling across the typical range of human weights. > > NH: I recommend that you read the paper by McCune et al. that formally tests the allometric theory prediction of an exponent of 3/4 for clearance based on a large study of busulfan across the human size range (McCune, Bemer et al. 2014). The theory was tested explicitly and no evidence found to reject the value of 3/4. Work with a drug where your expertise is renowned ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gD7BZIl2uzc) has clearly demonstrated the benefit of allometric theory across humans from infants to adults. Eleveld showed the fit was improved using theory based allometric scaling (Eleveld, Proost et al. 2014)Schuttler also demonstrated an improved fit with an estimated exponent for clearance 0.75 which is consistent with the theoretical value of 3/4 (Schuttler and Ihmsen 2000). > > In the spirit of modern scientific philosophy are you aware of unambiguous data (and analysis) that falsifies the theory of allometry ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Popper)? > > > SS: > >> As applied to human pharmacokinetics, I do not believe any theory supports allometric scaling. > > NH: As noted above there is nothing in the theory of allometry proposed by West that would mean it is not applicable to humans. If you do not want to believe this theory then that is your personal choice, as it would be for any religious belief, and I will not attempt to change your religion. > > > SS: > >> You can see this if you consider the ends of the spectrum. Small size is associated with children. They are not a separate species, but are humans undergoing metabolic maturation. > > NH: I have personally been a strong advocate on considering all humans, regardless of age, as being a single species and have sought integrated explanations of human clinical pharmacology. If you were aware of the paediatric pharmacokinetic literature then you would know of many publications supporting the use of a combination of theory based allometry for size plus empirical maturation models for age (see this review (Holford, Heo et al. 2013)). > > > > SS: > >> I am not aware of any allometric theory that accounts for metabolic maturation with age. > > NH: From the first commandment it necessarily follows that changes associated with age are not predictable from the allometric theory of West et al. There is no age related theory to predict quantitative changes. However, plausible biological understanding of maturation means that clearance will be zero (or at least very small) at conception and will approach a maximum when it will be indistinguishable from the mature adult value. So at least at the extremes there is a biological and quantitative prediction of maturation. Joining these extremes requires an empirical approach. A monotonic sigmoid emax function has been suggested (Tod, Jullien et al. 2008)and widely applied (Holford, Heo et al. 2013). A more complex function may be needed but this will need to be driven first by data not by theory. > > > SS: >> Similarly, very large size is associated with morbid obesity. I am not aware of any allometric theory that suggests that clearance in morbid obesity is best estimated using allometric principles. Between these extremes, scaling by weight is not very different than scaling by weight to the three quarters power. > > NH: Body composition contributes to body mass. Theory based allometry does not specify how differences in body composition affect allometric size. It is plausible however to propose that the size that is the driving force behind allometric theory may not be determined simply by total body weight. Application of theory based allometry in conjunction with fat free mass can be used to determine a normal fat mass (NFM) (Anderson and Holford 2009). The NFM concept has been used to account for body composition differences determining allometric size. NFM is not predicted from allometric theory but is a biologically plausible extension of the theory of allometric size based on mass. NFM has been used to show that total body mass rather than fat free mass provides a better description of propofol pharmacokinetics in the obese (Cortinez, Anderson et al. 2010). It has also be used to show that fat free mass is a better predictor of dexmedetomidine but obesity is associated with reduced clearance independently of allometric size based on fat free mass (Cortinez, Anderson et al. 2015). This demonstrates how the complexities of biology can be better understood based on a plausible theory of allometry. The theory may not be perfect but it is compatible with a very large number of observation studies in many domains. Investigation of other phenomena such as maturation and obesity is aided by building on allometric theory. > > > SS: > >> Of course, I will defer to data. Can you point me to human PK examples where allometric scaling of weight to the three quarters power reliably provides substantially better fits to the data than scaling by weight alone? > > NH: In addition to the large study of busulfan PK mentioned previously (McCune, Bemer et al. 2014)I suggest you look at the prediction of morphine clearance across the human size and age range using theory based allometry with maturation. Prediction of clearance in a large external data set was clearly better than other approaches including empirical allometry (Holford, Ma et al. 2012). Other published examples can be found in this review (Holford, Heo et al. 2013). > > > SS: > >> I can point to many examples where it makes no difference. I can also point to many examples where investigators simply use allometric scaling without first seeing if allometric scaling was supported by the data. > > NH: This is often the case when sample sizes are small, weight distribution is narrow and power is small (Anderson and Holford 2008). A pragmatic approach given the challenges of falsifying allometric theory with small data sets is to assume it is useful. It is certainly better than using empirical allometry or ignoring size altogether. > > > SS: >> However, I know of only one or two examples where models were estimated with and without allometric scaling, and the allometric scaling worked better than the simpler non-scaled model. If allometric scaling for human pharmacokinetics was “true” on first principles, as your comments imply, then the literature should abound with unequivocal examples. > > NH: If you know of examples of suitably powered studies which can also show they have accounted for other mass correlated factors that would confound the estimation of a true allometric exponent then I would be glad to know the details. > > If you read the literature carefully and exclude those that are underpowered to truly detect the difference between an exponent of 3/4 and say an exponent of 1 or an exponent of 2/3 and have accounted for all other factors, such as maturation, that are necessarily correlated with mass then you will not find many examples. I am not aware of any that are inconsistent with allometric theory. > > > SS: > >> Thanks, >> Steve >> -- >> Steven L. Shafer, MD >> Professor of Anesthesiology, Perioperative and Pain Medicine, Stanford University >> Adjunct Associate Professor of Bioengineering and Therapeutic Sciences, UCSF >> >> ######################################################################## >> >> PharmPK Home Page https://www.pharmpk.com/ >> Information about PK/PD Jobs can be found at https://www.pharmpk.com/pkjob.html >> More information about my eBooks, including Basic Pharmacokinetics and Pharmacy Math, and now iOS and tvOS apps can be found at https://www.pharmpk.com/MyeBooks.html >> Thank you, David Bourne, PharmPK Moderator >> >> To unsubscribe from the PHARMPK list, click the following link: >> http://lists.ucdenver.edu/scripts/wa.exe?SUBED1=PHARMPK&A=1 > > Anderson, B. J. and N. H. Holford (2008). "Mechanism-based concepts of size and maturity in pharmacokinetics." _Annu Rev Pharmacol Toxicol_ *48*: 303-332. > > Anderson, B. J. and N. H. G. Holford (2009). "Mechanistic basis of using body size and maturation to predict clearance in humans." _Drug Metab Pharmacokinet_ *24*(1): 25-36. > > Cortinez, L. I., B. J. Anderson, N. H. Holford, V. Puga, N. de la Fuente, H. Auad, S. Solari, F. A. Allende and M. Ibacache (2015). "Dexmedetomidine pharmacokinetics in the obese." _Eur J Clin Pharmacol_ *doi:10.1007/s00228-015-1948-2*. > > Cortinez, L. I., B. J. Anderson, A. Penna, L. Olivares, H. R. Munoz, N. H. Holford, M. M. Struys and P. Sepulveda (2010). "Influence of obesity on propofol pharmacokinetics: derivation of a pharmacokinetic model." _Br J Anaesth_ *105*(4): 448-456. > > Eleveld, D. J., J. H. Proost, L. I. Cortinez, A. R. Absalom and M. M. Struys (2014). "A general purpose pharmacokinetic model for propofol." _Anesthesia and analgesia_ *118*(6): 1221-1237. > > Holford, N. (2008). "Re: [NMusers] Scaling for pediatric study planning." http://www.cognigencorp.com/nonmem/current/2008-September/0182.html. > > Holford, N., Y. A. Heo and B. Anderson (2013). "A pharmacokinetic standard for babies and adults." _J Pharm Sci_ *102*(9): 2941-2952. > > Holford, N. H., S. C. Ma and B. J. Anderson (2012). "Prediction of morphine dose in humans." _Paediatr Anaesth_ *22*(3): 209-222. > > McCune, J. S., M. J. Bemer, J. S. Barrett, K. Scott Baker, A. S. Gamis and N. H. G. Holford (2014). "Busulfan in Infant to Adult Hematopoietic Cell Transplant Recipients: A Population Pharmacokinetic Model for Initial and Bayesian Dose Personalization." _Clinical Cancer Research_ *20*(3): 754-763. > > Schuttler, J. and H. Ihmsen (2000). "Population pharmacokinetics of propofol: a multicenter study." _Anesthesiology_ *92*(3): 727-738. > > Tod, M., V. Jullien and G. Pons (2008). "Facilitation of drug evaluation in children by population methods and modelling." _Clin Pharmacokinet_ *47*(4): 231-243. > > West, G. B., J. H. Brown and B. J. Enquist (1997). "A general model for the origin of allometric scaling laws in biology." _Science_ *276*: 122-126. > > -- > Nick Holford, Professor Clinical Pharmacology > Dept Pharmacology & Clinical Pharmacology, Bldg 503 Room 302A > University of Auckland,85 Park Rd,Private Bag 92019,Auckland,New Zealand > office:+64(9)923-6730 mobile:NZ+64(21)46 23 53 FR+33(6)62 32 46 72 > email:n.holford_at_auckland.ac.nz > http://holford.fmhs.auckland.ac.nz/ > > "Declarative languages are a form of dementia -- they have no memory of events" > > Holford SD, Allegaert K, Anderson BJ, Kukanich B, Sousa AB, Steinman A, Pypendop, B., Mehvar, R., Giorgi, M., Holford,N.H.G. Parent-metabolite pharmacokinetic models - tests of assumptions and predictions. Journal of Pharmacology & Clinical Toxicology. 2014;2(2):1023-34. > Holford N. Clinical pharmacology = disease progression + drug action. Br J Clin Pharmacol. 2015;79(1):18-27. >

Re: Understanding allometry

From: Nick Holford Date: May 29, 2016 technical
Dennis, I do not accept that my commentary and constructive criticism of the public remarks made by Steve Shafer should be considered an insult. Public discussion and criticism is essential to detect mistaken ideas and fraud ( http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/bcp.12992/full). I am proud to be a co-author of the McCune et al (2014) article. I don't understand what you are implying with your "vested interest" remark. My name was clearly written as a co-author in the reference list. Are you suggesting I should not cite the science in this area that I have been involved in for over 20 years? Thank you for looking at the McCune article. However, you are mistaken in suggesting that the "weight-normalized model" was not evaluated. This model (based on total body weight with an allometric exponent of 1) is a nested sub-model of size model described in the McCune article. When the allometric exponents are estimated the values provide no support for the "weight-normalized model" (see supplementary table 4). The objective function improves by 532.12 when a non-linear allometric model with 4 additional parameters is compared to the linear model. I find it strange that you offer anecdotally "Over the past two decades, I have analyzed data from > 200 studies" to support your "weight-normalized" view yet insist I provide EVIDENCE. If you wish to make a credible statement to support "weight-normalization" then I ask you to publish the DATA with analysis details showing that you account for factors such as maturation that are correlated with mass but are not part of theory based allometry, and apply allometric scaling to all clearance and volume parameters. With regard to SAFETY-- my work with allometric scaling applied to prediction of clearance is not an ivory tower activity. You will find details in the response I will send to Steve on PharmPK who raises a similar point in his comments. Best wishes, Nick McCune JS, Bemer MJ, Barrett JS, Scott Baker K, Gamis AS, Holford NHG. Busulfan in Infant to Adult Hematopoietic Cell Transplant Recipients: A Population Pharmacokinetic Model for Initial and Bayesian Dose Personalization. Clin Cancer Res. 2014;20(3):754-63.
Quoted reply history
On 23-May-16 15:51, Dennis Fisher wrote: > Nick > > Your condescending tone is not appropriate — Steve did not insu lt you nor should you insult him. An apology is due. > > You, Steve, and I had the same mentor — Lewis Sheiner. His mos t important teaching was LET THE DATA SPEAK. When theory and evidence clash, Lewis would not blindly stick to theory. In this instance, Steve asked you to provide EVIDENCE to support your claim that allometric scaling would yield markedly better fits than weight-normalization. You offered the McCune article to support your argument (without mentioning your vested interest as an author). In that article, you wrote: > > all clearance (CL,Q) and volume (V1,V2) parameters were scaled for body size and composition using allometric theory and predicted fat free mass (FFM).(19–21) > > It does not appear that you evaluated a weight-normalized model. If yo u don’t look, you never see! > > I also note that the table reports the following: > CL Clearance L/h/62kg NFM CL 11.4 (1.1) > This brings up the issue of SAFETY. I was a clinician for several deca des and Steve continues to be an active clinician. I don’t know if you see patients. However, many participants in this mailing list have never selected a dose of a drug, then administered it to a patient. I venture to say that most clinicians when faced with a dosing regimen that requires raising weight to the 3/4 power would run in the opposite direction (or, make a dosing error). The entry in the table is even more problematic. A clinician first needs to calculate NFM, then they need to realize that the dose is not proportional to 11.4 by a factor of weight/62. > > If the goal of PK is publishing journal articles about pure science, yo ur approach might be OK. But, as far as I know, the goal is to improve patient safety. If there were a strong (or even moderate) preference for allometrically-scaled models, I would support their use. But, Steve asked you to provide EVIDENCE for this and you failed to do you. You also cited Eleveld’s article. Although his manuscript did include one weight-normalized model, the allometric model required multiple additional terms to fit the data. In particular, that article (as yours) required a “maturation” term to describe younger patients. In other words, neither of these articles demonstrates that allometric models are sufficient to describe the range of sizes in humans. Had Eleveld added those extra terms to the weight-normalized model, it might have performed as well as the model he published. > > Over the past two decades, I have analyzed data from > 200 studies incl uding many in infants and children. In many of these, I have compared weight-normalized and allometric (and, in adults, unscaled) approaches. In virtually all cases, the difference in fit between the weight-normalized and allometric approaches was trivial and often favored the weight-normalized approach. Can you cite cases in which the allometric approach fares much better? > > I also have had the opportunity to be an editor for a journal and to re view articles for many journals (and I have reviewed submissions by many people who participate in this mailing list). In many instances, authors refuse to evaluate a weight-normalized model, citing you. In many of these instances, I have insisted that the authors conduct that analysis and (as far as I can recall) there has never been strong evidence to support the allometric model. > > I repeat — if you don’t look, you don’t see. > > I suspect that Steve will have more to add. > > Dennis > > Dennis Fisher MD > P < (The "P Less Than" Company) > Phone / Fax: 1-866-PLessThan (1-866-753-7784) > www.PLessThan.com > > > > >> On May 23, 2016, at 12:17 AM, Nick Holford<n.holford_at_auckland.ac.nz> wrote: >> >> Steve, >> >> Thanks for your comments and questions on theory based allometry. I ha ve cross-posted it to nmusers because this topic has been of interest there over many years. >> >> >> I am aware that you wrote an editorial on this topic with Denis Fisher which you titled “Allometry, Shallometry!”. Having read your editorial and your comments I don’t think the implication that allometry is shallow is appropriate. On the contrary, I get the impression (see below) that you and Denis do not really understand the biological principles underlying allometry and seem to be unaware of the substantial literature supporting theory based allometry and its application in humans. >> >> >> Would your journal be willing to receive a rejoinder to your editorial with a deeper explanation of the science and the literature? >> >> Best wishes, >> >> >> Nick >> >> Nick Holford, MBChB, FRACP >> >> Professor of Clinical Pharmacology, University of Auckland >> >> Adjunct Professor of Bioengineering and Therapeutic Sciences, UCSF >> >> >> On 21-May-16 00:42, Steven L Shafer<sshafer_at_stanford.edu> wrote: >>> Nick: >>> You say below: >>> "Theory based allometry predicts an exponent of 3/4 for many functi onal processes e.g. basal metabolism, cardiac output, lung volume flow (West et al 1997). It is not restricted to metabolism." >>> The article you cite by West is an excellent treatise on the subjec t of scaling across species. There are numerous other papers that provide theoretical foundations for allometric scaling across species (e.g., Darveau, Nature, 2002; West, J Exp Biol. 2005). The allometric theory accounts for differences in rate-related functions across species that span many orders of magnitude in body mass. I am not aware of any theory that supports scaling by weight to the 3/4 power WITHIN A SPECIES. >> NH: Unfortunately, you repeat a common misunderstanding of allometric theory that it is somehow only applicable across species. Allometric theory as originally proposed by West is based only on body mass (West, Brown et al. 1997). Allometric theory does not require consideration of species or any other covariate. This is the first commandment of allometry (Holford 2008). If you read the work by West et al. you will find that there is nothing in the theory that prevents its use for within species scaling using mass. Therefore the theory of West supports the use of the 3/4 exponent within species. >> >> >> SS: >>> Similarly, I am unaware of unambiguous data strongly supporting allom etric scaling across the typical range of human weights. >> NH: I recommend that you read the paper by McCune et al. that formally tests the allometric theory prediction of an exponent of 3/4 for clearance based on a large study of busulfan across the human size range (McCune, Bemer et al. 2014). The theory was tested explicitly and no evidence found to reject the value of 3/4. Work with a drug where your expertise is renowned ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gD7BZIl2uzc) has clearly demonstrated the benefit of allometric theory across humans from infants to adults. Eleveld showed the fit was improved using theory based allometric scaling (Eleveld, Proost et al. 2014)Schuttler also demonstrated an improved fit with an estimated exponent for clearance 0.75 which is consistent with the theoretical value of 3/4 (Schuttler and Ihmsen 2000). >> >> In the spirit of modern scientific philosophy are you aware of unambig uous data (and analysis) that falsifies the theory of allometry ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Popper)? >> >> >> SS: >> >>> As applied to human pharmacokinetics, I do not believe any theory s upports allometric scaling. >> NH: As noted above there is nothing in the theory of allometry propose d by West that would mean it is not applicable to humans. If you do not want to believe this theory then that is your personal choice, as it would be for any religious belief, and I will not attempt to change your religion. >> >> >> SS: >> >>> You can see this if you consider the ends of the spectrum. Small size is associated with children. They are not a separate species, but are humans undergoing metabolic maturation. >> NH: I have personally been a strong advocate on considering all humans , regardless of age, as being a single species and have sought integrated explanations of human clinical pharmacology. If you were aware of the paediatric pharmacokinetic literature then you would know of many publications supporting the use of a combination of theory based allometry for size plus empirical maturation models for age (see this review (Holford, Heo et al. 2013)). >> >> >> >> SS: >> >>> I am not aware of any allometric theory that accounts for metabolic m aturation with age. >> NH: From the first commandment it necessarily follows that changes ass ociated with age are not predictable from the allometric theory of West et al. There is no age related theory to predict quantitative changes. However, plausible biological understanding of maturation means that clearance will be zero (or at least very small) at conception and will approach a maximum when it will be indistinguishable from the mature adult value. So at least at the extremes there is a biological and quantitative prediction of maturation. Joining these extremes requires an empirical approach. A monotonic sigmoid emax function has been suggested (Tod, Jullien et al. 2008)and widely applied (Holford, Heo et al. 2013). A more complex function may be needed but this will need to be driven first by data not by theory. >> >> >> SS: >>> Similarly, very large size is associated with morbid obesity. I am no t aware of any allometric theory that suggests that clearance in morbid obesity is best estimated using allometric principles. Between these extremes, scaling by weight is not very different than scaling by weight to the three quarters power. >> NH: Body composition contributes to body mass. Theory based allometry does not specify how differences in body composition affect allometric size. It is plausible however to propose that the size that is the driving force behind allometric theory may not be determined simply by total body weight. Application of theory based allometry in conjunction with fat free mass can be used to determine a normal fat mass (NFM) (Anderson and Holford 2009). The NFM concept has been used to account for body composition differences determining allometric size. NFM is not predicted from allometric theory but is a biologically plausible extension of the theory of allometric size based on mass. NFM has been used to show that total body mass rather than fat free mass provides a better description of propofol pharmacokinetics in the obese (Cortinez, Anderson et al. 2010). It has also be used to show that fat free mass is a better predictor of dexmedetomidine but obesity is associated with reduced clearance independently of allometric size based on fat free mass (Cortinez, Anderson et al. 2015). This demonstrates how the complexities of biology can be better understood based on a plausible theory of allometry. The theory may not be perfect but it is compatible with a very large number of observation studies in many domains. Investigation of other phenomena such as maturation and obesity is aided by building on allometric theory. >> >> >> SS: >> >>> Of course, I will defer to data. Can you point me to human PK examp les where allometric scaling of weight to the three quarters power reliably provides substantially better fits to the data than scaling by weight alone? >> NH: In addition to the large study of busulfan PK mentioned previously (McCune, Bemer et al. 2014)I suggest you look at the prediction of morphine clearance across the human size and age range using theory based allometry with maturation. Prediction of clearance in a large external data set was clearly better than other approaches including empirical allometry (Holford, Ma et al. 2012). Other published examples can be found in this review (Holford, Heo et al. 2013). >> >> >> SS: >> >>> I can point to many examples where it makes no difference. I can also point to many examples where investigators simply use allometric scaling without first seeing if allometric scaling was supported by the data. >> NH: This is often the case when sample sizes are small, weight distrib ution is narrow and power is small (Anderson and Holford 2008). A pragmatic approach given the challenges of falsifying allometric theory with small data sets is to assume it is useful. It is certainly better than using empirical allometry or ignoring size altogether. >> >> >> SS: >>> However, I know of only one or two examples where models were estimat ed with and without allometric scaling, and the allometric scaling worked better than the simpler non-scaled model. If allometric scaling for human pharmacokinetics was “true” on first principles, as your comments imply, then the literature should abound with unequivocal examples. >> NH: If you know of examples of suitably powered studies which can also show they have accounted for other mass correlated factors that would confound the estimation of a true allometric exponent then I would be glad to know the details. >> >> If you read the literature carefully and exclude those that are underp owered to truly detect the difference between an exponent of 3/4 and say an exponent of 1 or an exponent of 2/3 and have accounted for all other factors, such as maturation, that are necessarily correlated with mass then you will not find many examples. I am not aware of any that are inconsistent with allometric theory. >> >> >> SS: >> >>> Thanks, >>> Steve >>> -- >>> Steven L. Shafer, MD >>> Professor of Anesthesiology, Perioperative and Pain Medicine, Stanfor d University >>> Adjunct Associate Professor of Bioengineering and Therapeutic Science s, UCSF >>> >>> ##################################################################### ### >>> >>> PharmPK Home Page https://www.pharmpk.com/ >>> Information about PK/PD Jobs can be found at https://www.pharmpk.com/p kjob.html >>> More information about my eBooks, including Basic Pharmacokinetics an d Pharmacy Math, and now iOS and tvOS apps can be found at https://www.pharmpk.com/MyeBooks.html >>> Thank you, David Bourne, PharmPK Moderator >>> >>> To unsubscribe from the PHARMPK list, click the following link: >>> http://lists.ucdenver.edu/scripts/wa.exe?SUBED1=PHARMPK&A=1 >> Anderson, B. J. and N. H. Holford (2008). "Mechanism-based concepts of size and maturity in pharmacokinetics." _Annu Rev Pharmacol Toxicol_ *48*: 303-332. >> >> Anderson, B. J. and N. H. G. Holford (2009). "Mechanistic basis of usi ng body size and maturation to predict clearance in humans." _Drug Metab Pharmacokinet_ *24*(1): 25-36. >> >> Cortinez, L. I., B. J. Anderson, N. H. Holford, V. Puga, N. de la Fuen te, H. Auad, S. Solari, F. A. Allende and M. Ibacache (2015). "Dexmedetomidine pharmacokinetics in the obese." _Eur J Clin Pharmacol_ *doi:10.1007/s00228-015-1948-2*. >> >> Cortinez, L. I., B. J. Anderson, A. Penna, L. Olivares, H. R. Munoz, N . H. Holford, M. M. Struys and P. Sepulveda (2010). "Influence of obesity on propofol pharmacokinetics: derivation of a pharmacokinetic model." _Br J Anaesth_ *105*(4): 448-456. >> >> Eleveld, D. J., J. H. Proost, L. I. Cortinez, A. R. Absalom and M. M. Struys (2014). "A general purpose pharmacokinetic model for propofol." _Anesthesia and analgesia_ *118*(6): 1221-1237. >> >> Holford, N. (2008). "Re: [NMusers] Scaling for pediatric study plannin g." >> http://www.cognigencorp.com/nonmem/current/2008-September/0182.html. >> Holford, N., Y. A. Heo and B. Anderson (2013). "A pharmacokinetic stan dard for babies and adults." _J Pharm Sci_ *102*(9): 2941-2952. >> >> Holford, N. H., S. C. Ma and B. J. Anderson (2012). "Prediction of mor phine dose in humans." _Paediatr Anaesth_ *22*(3): 209-222. >> >> McCune, J. S., M. J. Bemer, J. S. Barrett, K. Scott Baker, A. S. Gamis and N. H. G. Holford (2014). "Busulfan in Infant to Adult Hematopoietic Cell Transplant Recipients: A Population Pharmacokinetic Model for Initial and Bayesian Dose Personalization." _Clinical Cancer Research_ *20*(3): 754-763. >> >> Schuttler, J. and H. Ihmsen (2000). "Population pharmacokinetics of pr opofol: a multicenter study." _Anesthesiology_ *92*(3): 727-738. >> >> Tod, M., V. Jullien and G. Pons (2008). "Facilitation of drug evaluati on in children by population methods and modelling." _Clin Pharmacokinet_ *47*(4): 231-243. >> >> West, G. B., J. H. Brown and B. J. Enquist (1997). "A general model fo r the origin of allometric scaling laws in biology." _Science_ *276*: 122-126. >> >> -- Nick Holford, Professor Clinical Pharmacology Dept Pharmacology & Clinical Pharmacology, Bldg 503 Room 302A University of Auckland,85 Park Rd,Private Bag 92019,Auckland,New Zealand office:+64(9)923-6730 mobile:NZ+64(21)46 23 53 FR+33(6)62 32 46 72 email:n.holford_at_auckland.ac.nz http://holford.fmhs.auckland.ac.nz/ "Declarative languages are a form of dementia -- they have no memory of events" Holford SD, Allegaert K, Anderson BJ, Kukanich B, Sousa AB, Steinman A, Pypendop, B., Mehvar, R., Giorgi, M., Holford,N.H.G. Parent-metabolite pharmacokinetic models - tests of assumptions and predictions. Journal of Pharmacology & Clinical Toxicology. 2014;2(2):1023-34. Holford N. Clinical pharmacology = disease progression + drug action. Br J Clin Pharmacol. 2015;79(1):18-27.

Understanding allometry

From: Nick Holford Date: June 01, 2016 technical
Dear Steve, Thanks for your responses of 22 May and 24 May PDT. Due to some unexplained technical problem I have not been receiving posts from PharmPK since 23 May and only just became aware of your 24 May post. I have tried twice to post a response to PharmPK but it has not appeared on the list as far as I can tell. I am therefore transferring this discussion to nmusers. On 22 May you wrote “I am not aware of any theory that supports scaling by weight to the 3/4 power WITHIN A SPECIES”. Having read the 22 May post from Douglas Eleveld and my own reply do you now accept that the theory of West et al. supports 3/4 power weight scaling within a species including humans? My comments below are in response to your PharmPK post of 24 May. Best wishes, Nick SS: Dear Nick: You stated in your comments to me, both on NMUSERS and on PHARMPK, that a paper of yours with Dr. McCune offered a validation of the use of allometric scaling. Dennis Fisher has already commented on this paper. Dennis said I might have additional comments. As usual, Dennis is right. The paper is McCune et al, Busulfan in infant to adult hematopoietic cell transplant recipients: a population pharmacokinetic model for initial and Bayesian dose personalization.. Clin Cancer Res. 2014;20:754-63. Based on my reading of your paper, and the supplementary material, I would like to offer several observations. 1. Quoting from page 755: “To characterize busulfan pharmacokinetics over the entire age continuum, all clearance (CL,Q) and volume (V1, V2) parameters were scaled for body size and composition using allometric theory and predicted fat-free mass.” In other words, you assumed allometric theory at the outset of your analysis. NH: It is correct that theory based allometry was used at the outset to guide the analysis. This was based not only the biological plausibility of this theory but also the consistent use of non-linear weight scaling in all previous reports of IV busulfan PK (see McCune Supplementary Table 1). The results of non-linear regression using NONMEM are well known to be better when starting from a priori more reasonable models and parameters. A deeper understanding of the problem is always helpful. SS: 2. I think your testing of this assumption is described on page 759: “we estimated the allometric exponents for each of the 4 main pharmacokinetic parameters (Supplementary Table S4). Initial estimates of 2/3 and 1.25 were used for the clearance and volume exponents.” However, you tested this with bootstrap, not with log-likelihood profiles. Why? NH: A recognized limitation of log-likelihood profiles is the focus on just one parameter at a time plus interpretation of the confidence interval is dependent on the assumption that the difference in -2LL is Chi-squared distributed. As I am sure you know that is a questionable assumption when using the NONMEM approximation to the likelihood. While the bootstrap cannot be considered perfect it has useful properties compared with log-likelihood profiles because it allows the uncertainty for all exponents to be estimated simultaneously. The log-likelihood profile method provides a rather superficial view because it only allows the uncertainty for one parameter at time while fixing other parameters at some other values. SS: 3. If allometry makes little difference, then it is an expected result that your final estimates would be close to the starting parameters. This might especially be the case where there are 10 parameters in the calculation of clearance (see item 10 below), compromising the “navigability” of the model away from the starting estimate of PWR when the other 9 parameters start at the value determined by assuming that PWR=0.75. NH: The initial estimates for the bootstrap were deliberately set to values that were quite distant from the theory based values (page 759, para 1). This would be expected to allow the exponent estimates to “navigate” more freely. As you point out it is possible that there would be some kind of “memory” in the other parameters of the model determined using theory based exponents.This is a good idea. I have tried to test it by fitting the data with initial estimates assuming that total body weight is the allometric mass with an allometric exponent for CL and V parameters equal to 1 (linear weight model). The results of such a fit should have no “memory” of theory based values. I then refit the data starting from the final estimates of this linear weight model and estimated the allometric exponents for CL, V, Q and V2 (empirical allometric model). The bootstrap confidence intervals for these exponents estimated from the empirical allometric model with total body weight are shown here: Parameter Description Bootstrap Average 2.5% ile 97.5% ile Bootstrap RSE PWR_CL Allometric exponent for CL 0.764 0.733 0.798 2.3% PWR_V Allometric exponent for V1 1.011 0.871 1.115 5.6% PWR_Q Allometric exponent for Q 0.838 0.734 0.957 6.7% PWR_V2 Allometric exponent for V2 0.930 0.885 0.988 2.6% It is clear that the exponent estimates for CL and V consistent with theory based allometry and inconsistent with a linear weight model. Not accounting for body composition probably explains why the confidence interval for V2 just misses the theory based prediction. This is not due to a “memory” problem because very similar results were obtained starting from theory based initial estimates and total body weight as shown in McCune supplementary table 4. The objective function value (OFV) difference between the linear model and the empirical allometric model is 532.12 with 4 estimated parameters. This difference in OFV would usually be interpreted to show that the non-linear allometric model is superior to the linear function of weight. This is letting the data speak and it is shouting out that the linear model is inconsistent with the data. SS: 4. I stated in my comments that allometric theory did not account for the upper extreme of obesity. You agree, since you found it necessary to corrected allometric scaling with an additional parameter to account for the effects of obesity. NH: I am happy to see that we agree that “obesity” is not part of theory based allometry. However, please recognise that the mass associated with “obesity” would be expected under theory based allometry to have an influence. A deeper, biological question is what is this mass? The West et al.theory does not specify how to account for mass, such as excess fat, that probably has metabolic properties different from mass with “normal” body composition. The NFM method estimates the combination of fat free mass and fat mass that best agrees with allometric theory. The assumption of allometric theory then allows insights into the contributions of these components to “normal” allometric size. SS: 5. I stated in my comments that allometric theory did not account for maturation. You agree, since you found it necessary to add an additional parameter for maturation. NH: I am very happy to see that we agree that allometric theory does not account for maturation. That is why a separate model component (with 2 parameters TM50CL and HIllCL) is included to account for maturation of clearance. SS: 6. You had actual body weight for only 133 subjects in this study, of which only 24 subjects were less than 18 years of age (supplementary table 2). Although your model has 1610 individuals, you only estimated the allometric portion of your model from 24 children. This allometric scaling parameter was assumed to be true for all 1407 subjects (calculated from supplementary table 2). Since your allometric parameter, Ffat, was derived from just 24 children, and applied to all 1407 children, your testing (supplementary table S4) may be a tautology. NH: It is indeed a limitation of this data analysis that most of the hospitals who contributed data did not supply actual body weight but a “dosing weight” (see below). Ffat contributes to the allometric part of the model but recall that allometric theory does not include maturation. The Ffat parameters were estimated from all 133 subjects , irrespective of age, with actual body weight recorded. Therefore I do not agree with your assertion that I “only estimated the allometric portion of your model from 24 children”. SS: 7. You state on page 755 that you used the dosing weight in reference 18. Reference 18 is Gibbs, et al, The Impact of Obesity and Disease on Busulfan Oral Clearance in Adults, Blood 1999;93:4436-40. Reference 18 discusses actual body weight, body surface area, adjusted ideal body weight, and ideal body weight, all calculated from standard formulae. There is no reference to Dosing Weight in this publication. NH: You are correct. There is no reference describing DWT for patients outside Seattle. This is because the method used to calculate DWT was calculated using each institution’s own practice (see page 755, col 2, end of 2nd paragraph describing the study population). The exact method was not supplied with the data provided for each patient by the institution. The dosing weight in Seattle was not used for model development because actual body weight was recorded. SS: 8. Dennis pointed out the potential safety concerns of allometric scaling. I suggest that interested readers look at page 756 of your paper. If that does not scare clinicians, then the exact math for dose calculation appears in supplementary table 7. Would you be comfortable if the oncologist treating your child had to calculate dose based on the complex, interlocking equations required to estimate body size? What theoretical advantage in dose calculation justifies the potential for computational error inherent in supplementary table 7? The risk vs. benefit of allometric scaling cannot be determined from the data in the paper. NH: You bring up an interesting issue that was never the subject of this paper.Unfortunately, the literature abounds with evidence that doctors e.g. anesthetists (Nanji, Patel et al. 2016), often make dosing errors. My work with allometric scaling applied to prediction of clearance and dosing is not an ivory tower activity.Safe dosing of dangerous medicines requires good science and validated methods to ensure the correct dose is administered. The calculation of the dose for busulfan is complex. This is the only drug I know of where the FDA has recommended detailed dose individualization including calculation of an AUC in order to use the drug (FDA 2015). At the request of my clinical colleagues in Auckland, I was involved in the implementation and testing of a tool to guide busulfan dosing in children and adults. The tool was initially based on an FDA study (Booth, Rahman et al. 2007) describing an allometrically scaled model for clearance and was subsequently updated using the results in the McCune paper when an audit showed the predictions were better. The web based dosing tool (www.nextdose.org) has been in use for over 4 years to guide dosing of all patients in New Zealand receiving high dose busulfan for bone marrow ablation. The tool is available for use by anybody who has access to the internet. I understand that the model will be used to guide dosing of all patients in the USA who have samples submitted to the national laboratory in Seattle for measurement of busulfan concentrations. It is my personal hope that dosing decisions will be taken out of the hands of doctors who rarely recognize the principles of rational dosing and continue to use ad hoc empirical methods. To quote from your “Allometry, Shallometry!” editorial, with an example based on what you claim is a simple approach using the linear weight model: “It is OK if you skipped the math. As a clinician, all you need to know is the punchline”. You have been a pioneer in this area with target controlled infusions so I don’t think I have to convince you that this is the way of the future. Doctors should be responsible for providing the data to decide on an appropriate dose and after that a science based computation tool should work out the dose. SS: 9. You have no data showing how well your model predicts individual patients. The closest you come are the visual predictive checks (figure 1) and the prediction corrected visual predictive check (supplement 2). This tells me that the cloud of points is about right. That’s fine, but the average patient does not die. It is patient at the extremes of prediction accuracy who are at increased risk. The data, as presented, does not provide this information. NH: This paper is based on pharmacokinetic data. There is no effectiveness or safety data to judge risk. However, we have described the expected fraction of patients that would be expected to be within an acceptable range of concentrations using a predicted initial dose. Our model performs better than other methods in nearly all the scenarios we tested and is never worse to a clinically important degree. As noted above a web based dosing system using this approach has been used by clinicians in Auckland for over 4 years. SS: 10. Clearance (page 757) is calculated 10 parameters: a population estimate, which is adjusted for F(size), F(maturation), and F(sex). F(size) is based on dosing weight (not explained, see 7 above), height, WHS(50), WHS(max), F(fat), FFEM(DW), and PWR (your allometric parameter, fixed at ¾). F(maturation) is based on PMA, TM(50), and the Hill coefficient. F(sex) is a further adjustment for sex. When clearance is a function of 10 parameters, I do not see how this tests allometric scaling. Indeed, if allometric scaling were hurting your fit (unlikely – more likely it makes no difference, see below), other parameters might compensate to fit the data. NH: Please look at Table 2 to count the parameters in the fixed effect model. There are 12 estimated parameters. The number of parameters is not a “test of allometric scaling”. It is a measure of the complexity of variability of busulfan PK. These parameters identify predictable sources of variability that can be used to aid initial dosing. SS: 11. You compare this model to models by Trame, Paci, and Bartelink, noting that your model performs much better than these models. You are comparing your model with 12 structural parameters to models with 2 (Trame), 4 (Paci), and 5 (Bartelink) structural parameters. Your 12 parameter model better described your data than these simpler structural models fit to your data. Did you expect anything else? NH: I certainly expected to find our model would do better because it has a stronger mechanistic and biological basis. It is more complex than others because it goes more deeply into biological understanding and does better over a wide range of human size and age. SS: 12. You state on page 762: “The model is based on principles that have already been shown to be robust for predictions with other small molecule agents from neonates to adults.” I don’t see that. If “robust” means that it allometric helps describe PK at the extremes of weight, then the allometric model was not robust. It required adjustments for both maturation and for obesity. Between these extremes, say 30-100 kg, any optimal coefficient times weight to the ¾ power will differ by less than 10% from an optimal coefficient times weight alone. This will be invisible given the order of magnitude variability in clearance (your figure 2). NH: Robust refers to principles which recognize the major role of size and maturation (the key components of our model) in explaining variability in PK for many drugs (see (Holford, Heo et al. 2013)).The influence of body composition as a predictor of allometric size has fewer examples but it is only by digging below the surface that we can discover new things and evaluate their importance. It is no surprised that over a narrow range (30-100 kg) a linear model is a reasonable approximation to theory based allometry. But this is not true over the range of TBW (3 to 140 kg; see Figure 1) in the patients in this study (see below). SS: I see little to no evidence that your paper with Dr. McCune demonstrated superiority of allometry. Rather, your paper demonstrated that even a model with 12 parameters could not reduce the variability of busulfan estimated clearance beyond an order of magnitude. NH: If the model can predict how to reduce variability by an order of magnitude for a very toxic drug such as busulfan then I think this is a major advance. It makes no difference how many parameters are needed. The important thing is to be able to predict differences in PK which can then be applied to achieve safe and effective dosing. If this was my child faced with a bone marrow transplant I would want to use every means possible to improve the chances of a successful graft and reduce the substantial risk of serious toxicity and death. The simulations you provide in your “Allometry, Shallometry!” editorial replicate what I demonstrated 20 years ago (Holford 1996). I pointed out at that time the underestimation of doses predicted from adults if a linear weight model was assumed. You appear to propose using the same mg/kg dose in a children as in adults for computational convenience. But clinically recommended dosing regimens for busulfan use a higher mg/kg dose in younger and lighter children with lower mg/kg doses for older and heavier children. The allometric and maturation model we have developed predicts and explains this pattern of mg/kg dosing recommendations for busulfan and all other drugs used in humans (Holford, Heo et al. 2013). SS: You also demonstrated that allometric models require specific adjustments for maturation and dosing. You will recall this was one of the points that I made in my comments, which are also discussed in the Allometry Shallomatry! editorial. NH: I think we are in agreement that theory based allometry can only explain variability due to differences in body mass. Other factors also explain variability such as maturation, organ function, drug interactions, genotypes, etc. These factors have no influence on the allometric component of the model. I do not agree with you when you say that allometric models requires “specific adjustments” using factors such as maturation. If you tried to understand more deeply the allometric model you would realize it is not based on these other factors. SS: Perhaps there are other analyses of these data that would demonstrate a significant benefit of allometric scaling of data. If you are willing to share with me your data on the 133 subjects for whom you have actual body weights, I would be happy to address the question directly. NH: I understand that Jeannine McCune has contacted you and offered to work with you to obtain permission to use the data. SS: Respectfully, Steve -- Steven L. Shafer, MD Professor of Anesthesiology, Perioperative and Pain Medicine, Stanford University Adjunct Associate Professor of Bioengineering and Therapeutic Sciences, UCSF NH: References Booth, B. P., A. Rahman, R. Dagher, D. Griebel, S. Lennon, D. Fuller, C. Sahajwalla, M. Mehta and J. V. Gobburu (2007). "Population pharmacokinetic-based dosing of intravenous busulfan in pediatric patients." _J Clin Pharmacol_ *47*(1): 101-111. FDA (2015). "Busulfex Product Label http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2015/020954s014lbl.pdf." ; Holford, N., Y. A. Heo and B. Anderson (2013). "A pharmacokinetic standard for babies and adults." _J Pharm Sci_ *102*(9): 2941-2952. Holford, N. H. (1996). "A size standard for pharmacokinetics." _Clin Pharmacokinet_ *30*(5): 329-332. Nanji, K. C., A. Patel, S. Shaikh, D. L. Seger and D. W. Bates (2016). "Evaluation of Perioperative Medication Errors and Adverse Drug Events." _Anesthesiology_ *124*(1): 25-34. -- Nick Holford, Professor Clinical Pharmacology Dept Pharmacology & Clinical Pharmacology, Bldg 503 Room 302A University of Auckland,85 Park Rd,Private Bag 92019,Auckland,New Zealand office:+64(9)923-6730 mobile:NZ+64(21)46 23 53 FR+33(6)62 32 46 72 email:[email protected] http://holford.fmhs.auckland.ac.nz/ "Declarative languages are a form of dementia -- they have no memory of events" Holford SD, Allegaert K, Anderson BJ, Kukanich B, Sousa AB, Steinman A, Pypendop, B., Mehvar, R., Giorgi, M., Holford,N.H.G. Parent-metabolite pharmacokinetic models - tests of assumptions and predictions. Journal of Pharmacology & Clinical Toxicology. 2014;2(2):1023-34. Holford N. Clinical pharmacology = disease progression + drug action. Br J Clin Pharmacol. 2015;79(1):18-27.